Greening Concerts Globally Since 1990 | S5 E2

Michael Martin joins Earth Care for episode 2 of the Sustainability in the Live Music Industry series. 

Michael has been pioneering green initiatives in the live music industry since the 90’s. Before entering a world of sustainable innovation, he worked as an investment banker on Wall Street. In 1989, the Exxon Valdez oil disaster happened and influenced Michael to change gears.

Since then, Michael has set out on a mission to use the power of capitalism and pop culture to create impactful and positive change in the world. He works with superstar artists to put green initiatives in motion on major stages across the globe.

I

n fact, Billboard described Michael as the guru of live event greening.

He is the CEO and Founder of Effect Partners, a company that builds climate solutions with some of the largest food, entertainment and mission-aligned organizations on the planet. He’s also the CEO and Founder of R.World, the nation’s #1 reuse platform. 

In this episode, Michael Martin discusses his journey and the challenges faced in implementing sustainable practices. He shares his early motivation for positive change and his work in producing environmentally focused concerts. Michael highlights the R.Cup system, a tool he created to reduce waste at live events, and the importance of implementing sustainable practices at major venues. He also discusses the need to get more artists on board with sustainability initiatives and the potential for regulation to drive reusable options.

Connect with Michael Martin: hello@rworldreuse.com

Episode Transcription:

Sarah Christie

Michael Martin, instrumental voice and absolute trailblazer in the world of live music and sustainability. Thank you so much for being on Earth Care and joining this conversation about sustainability in the live music industry. It really is an honour to have you joining this series. How are you doing?

Michael Martin

Great, I'm doing great. It's Minnesota here where it should be 10 degrees. It's been 60 and 70 degrees and it went from like 60 degrees to minus 20 overnight. So it's great that it's warm, but it's really bad that it's warm. You know?

Sarah Christie

It just did the same thing here. It was plus 15 and then dropped to minus 10. And I said, I cringe every time someone says it's nice when we have these unseasonably warm temperatures. So you just made me feel very seen. So thank you for that. Now, I want to start with kind of that initial light bulb moment for you. I've heard you speak about, you know, using capitalism and pop culture to create change. What was it about those two things for you that went, OK, yeah, we can we can do this?

Michael Martin

It's a great question. And it predates social media. I used to be an investment banker on Wall Street and Exxon Valdez happened. And I thought that capitalism shouldn't be destroying the planet. It could be using the power of capitalism for doing good things. And I loved music. And I just felt that music opened the hearts of people and that if we could...

you know, use that platform and the fact that you have artists who travel around the world and see things and can connect with people and can actually talk to people, that we could actually create, you know, combine these two things to create meaningful change. And, you know, so over the years, I've done a lot of work around that concept of, you know, creating the first global warming campaign, for example, with Ben and Jerry's and Unilever, the Dave Matthews band.

Ben and Jerry's One Sweet World global warming flavour and working with different aspects of culture to move the needle on topics such as green energy or hybrid cars or corporate responsibility, organic food, plant -based food. And that's how I've been doing it. I just sort of learned on the street as I've been working through this trying to figure it out.

Sarah Christie

So if we go back to 1990, executive producer of the nationally broadcast Earth Day Stadium concerts, when I read about this, it almost seems, I keep saying the word unprecedented just because so many of these ideas still seem very new to us. But back in 1990, you were putting on environmentally focused concerts. So what did that look like then and how does that compare to what you're able to do on a large scale now?

Michael Martin

Wow, you know, yeah, it was, and I would be really clear about this. So there's no confusion. So what we did was in 1990, I produced the concert that brought the artists in and the funding in to put on the rally on the mall in Washington DC with the half million people. The next day I get a call from this guy says, my name is Jonathan Kraft. My dad just bought the New England Patriots. We love what you did. If you

if we give you our stadium, will you put that on here. So for the next four years, 1991, 95, that's when we did the stadium concerts and acted as a tentpole event to help catalyze Earth Day events around the country and then help to form Earth Day Network, which is the Earth Day organization. And you're right, no one was doing this, no one was doing it, no one was thinking about producing

concerts with a focus on sustainability. We got rid of the laminates and we started doing recycling and we started composting, we set up eco villages. And I just sort of thought, how can you use this platform to create change? And so these national radio promotions, it all had educational components to it. It just seemed like the right thing to do. And it's funny because apparently I was sort of the crazy guy in the corner because nobody else was.

I mean, these artists, you know, amazing, Paul McCartney and Ringo Starr, reunited Don Henley, Kenny Loggins, Ziggy Marley, R.E.M. You know, we had literally a hundred different artists that saw this. Again, artists like Canary in a coal mine, they see the importance of, they see what's happening in the world and they speak about it. And so, you know, but then the rest of the industry was sort of, it's been challenging to get the industry moving in that direction. You know, COVID.

And your generation coming along has changed the dynamics where now all of a sudden it's the hot topic in the music industry. It's a hot topic in media. Sadly, every day there is now headline stories about the environmental changes that are happening, the impact, and whether it's a fire or a flood or a hurricane. Right now there's record fires in Texas and you got the Canadian forest burning up last summer.

Michael Martin

You know, every day there's something now It's sad, but the way we humans are, sometimes you need to be directly touched by something in order to take action on it. Because if not, it's out the sight out of mind, you know, I equate it to similarly, you know, if your father, you know, gets a heart attack, all of a sudden, you're going to start paying attention to what you're eating.

You know, it's one of those things where it just, you're touched by something so it affects you. That was a long -winded answer. I'm sorry, I sort of wandered off what you asked, but.

Sarah Christie

Yeah, absolutely.

No, and as we record this actually wildfire season out in Alberta has already begun in February. And I think about that all the time because we're very protected being by the Great Lakes here in Southwestern Ontario in terms of, you know, heavy climate changes. But last summer, the wildfires were so extreme that we were, we could smell it here in Toronto and the skies changed in New York City. So it was kind of this, whoa, like it is happening and it's happening here too.

Michael Martin

Yeah.

Sarah Christie

So what has been or maybe still is, what are some of the most challenging areas when it comes to sitting back and planning ways to reduce the impact of a tour, a major stadium tour?

Michael Martin

Well, it's interesting because we used to break it down by, okay, you've got waste, you got water, you got emissions, you got activism or how do you activate fans. And in some ways, it's all got to be about climate change because all this stuff impacts climate change in a lot of ways, right? So it's a very interesting, different, I mean, it still needs to take each of those different components. So.

When we work with artists, what we'll do is we'll meet the artists, find out or the festival or whatever, what their concerns are, what they're willing to do, what they're not willing to do, how aggressive are they willing to be? Like when we did Jack Johnson's and developed his whole platform, it was great because he allowed me to put in their rider that if the venue didn't take some of these steps, they would need to pay a donation of like $500 to a local environmental group. Right. And.

Sarah Christie

Oh wow.

Michael Martin

And it was really cool because it was okay, you know, just, and what we did, we gave them an option of like five things in the, like in the food areas they could do, right? They could do organic food, they could do plant -based food, or they could do a food bank deal. And they had to do at least one of them, or we'd request they make a donation. And we have other artists that I've toured with that they care about it, but they are,

you know, they maybe aren't going to go to the mat like that. And, and, and so what we would, what it would do, what I do is we will, we will advance the venue. We'll reach out to the venues and go through a list of it's about a four page questionnaire of things, talking about everything from the low flow shower heads, what type of lighting do they have, the recycling set up, compost setup, what to do with excess food, you know, solar energy, they have short power for plugging in the trucks and buses, they don't have to run on diesel.

There's literally a hundred different things. You go through and you ask them what they're doing and you coach them on what they can do better. This is a weird thing. Most venues do not have potable water backstage. So what we do is we have to tour with drinking fountains and get five gallon containers of water delivered so we can then get tours. This is Roger Waters tour.

to use reusable containers instead of just single use cups for water and so forth. So you think about everything. So that's the challenge. The cool thing is what's happened now from doing this for so many years, and I started this, and now there's a bunch of other organizations that do it, one called REVERB and so forth that do this. What we...

What's happened now, you start to call, hey, okay, we'll talk with the caterer backstage. Now we don't want any single use items. We want glassware, we want silverware, we want China and so forth. And it starts to be something where we'll call a venue and start to say this. And they'll say, no, stop, I get it. Enough tours have come through and asked for this that we've switched to that now permanently. And that was what I hoped when I created the Enviro rider is that it would become this thing that it would become.

Michael Martin

you know, normalized to do the right thing as opposed to the wrong thing that we've all been steered to for a variety of reasons, which I could talk about, but that's, I think, a different topic.

Sarah Christie

Yes, just to make it the norm. It's so simple. It sounds so simple, but it's clearly taking, you know, takes a very dedicated team to put it in motion. Now you mentioned reusables and you mentioned water. I want to ask about R. cup, Um, one of the tools, one of the many tools you've created to reduce waste. How does the R cup system work?

Michael Martin

Thank you for asking. I'm going to get a visual aid here. I should've brought it up. So the idea with this was there's four billion single -use cups thrown out every year at live events alone. And it makes no sense because it's a one -time use. And it just makes no sense. And so what we did is we started off and said, OK, let's create a artist -branded cup. You pay a $3 deposit. You use it throughout the event. And at the end of the event, you could turn the cup in.

and get your $3 back or keep it. And that's, we did that for several years with like 13 different artists. Everyone from Radiohead to Mark Frinson, Bon Jovi, Rod Stewart, Maggie Rogers, and so forth. It was amazing. Cause there's no waste on the ground at the end of the event. But what I realized actually during COVID, which by the way, it was really fun to have a company completely based on live events during COVID. So you can imagine, but that really the problem with that is we were just selling souvenir cups.

Sarah Christie

Right.

Michael Martin

And that really was not the mission. And so we evolved the model to produce ugly cups like this that we would harvest at the venues. People couldn't leave the building with it. And then we would wash them, sterilize them, use them over and over. And so what R. Cup is actually realize it's more than just cups we are serveware too. So like clam shells and so forth. So that's R. World. We actually changed the name of the company to R. World, R period, W -O -R -L -D. And...

It has been really cool. Our mission is to build the national infrastructure for the reuse movement and build the movement for reuse the economy. And so that's what we're doing. We're operating currently in seven states, 44 cities. We'll be expanding to a bunch of other cities here over the next two years to be able to provide a national reuse solution.

Sarah Christie

That's incredible and just so important, especially like we going back to the weather situation. You know, it's so clear. There are so many signs that serious change needs to happen. It occurred to me while I was, you know, jotting down notes for this interview. U2 just had, they've been performing at the Sphere, you know, 18 ,000 seats. Are the cups, is this system in place over at the Sphere as well?

Michael Martin

It is, it's been to a bunch of those shows. It's an amazing show. There's only two left. So you won't see it probably if you're watching this, but it's absolutely amazing. Yeah, we implemented there. It's been phenomenal. U2 as a band are so supportive. A lot of these artists that I've mentioned, including U2, are investors in R. World because they want to grow it. They want to support it. They think this is a solution that's needed. So yeah, it's been pretty, it's an amazing venue and amazing experience.

at the sphere with U2.

Sarah Christie

Well, and to use the word instrumental again, I think it's quite powerful to see that system in place in Las Vegas, which isn't necessarily notorious for being the most eco -friendly city and, you know, waste reduction practices aren't necessarily at the forefront of your mind when you're thinking about Vegas. So that's really cool to see. Now, what do you think, what will it take for more artists, you know, these superstar artists that have the resources available to get on board with

this kind of change and embracing the sustainable change.

Michael Martin

That's a good question. I think the key thing is it needs to be made easy to them and to make so they can take action that will have leveraged impact given their profile. You know, I formed an organization with a longtime friend, Amy Morrison, recently, which is called the Music Sustainability Alliance. It's essentially the green association for the music industry. And it's really exciting because the idea with this is let's

create an organization that everybody can work together on to create systemic change. What I saw was there was a lot of sort of wheels being reinvented over the years, right? People all of a sudden, you know, last year started to say, hey, let's come up with this concept called an Enviro rider, enviro rider. I'll write it. And I think I did that 30 years ago. It's in action in place and it lets us, let's get this information out there so that everybody can build on what's already there rather than reinvent the wheel and diffusing resources and energy. We got to get

across all the different verticals in the industry, people talking to each other, how do you get routing to work better? Why do we have to be transporting steel and light rigs and everything all across the country? Can't we have it residing in the cities? And we're shipping literally things across the ocean, around the world that they have in those areas. Let's figure out systems to do that. How do you route tours more efficiently? And to do this sort of systemic change, you need to work together, you need to collaborate.

You need to have a place where people can come together and get to know each other and work together to solve for this.

Sarah Christie

Before I let you go, I want to be so conscious of your time. You've been working with the White House and I'm curious, you know, going to the White House, talking with legislation about single use and reuse options. Is there a scenario where this becomes regulation? You know, reusable options becomes regulation and that's actually put in place.

Michael Martin

You know, it's happening actually in some places already and it's exciting. You know, there's a lot of businesses that don't want it to happen. Single use manufacturers, some consumer product goods companies, they don't like the thought of having to take complete responsibility for their own waste. They want to be able to externalize those costs and have communities pay for it. But I think that the, you know, we have some communities in California.

and in Northeast that are actually implementing this fee for doing single use. I think that will happen. The stuff with the White House has really been exciting. It's really more about how to, the Biden administration is really committed to reducing CO2 emissions and waste and reuse really addresses those. And so there's some efforts happening out there that we've been working with over the last.

year or so working to try to get the federal agencies to embrace reuse. And there's a lot of great organizations upstream and others that are working to get the word out about this and have an impact. I've been Testifying in Minneapolis, here before the Minnesota House and Senate about an EPR, extended produce responsibility legislation that would allow required corporations to essentially pay for the cost of recycling systems and waste systems and reuse systems.

so that consumers and taxpayers aren't subsidizing these corporations' profits.

Sarah Christie

Wow, that is so encouraging to hear. Michael, thank you so much for your time. I truly can't thank you enough. It's been such a pleasure and such an honour to have you be on Earth Care.

Michael Martin

Well, thanks for reaching out. Good to connect, Sarah.

FINISHED.